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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 4, 2012 18:54:33 GMT -6
Alright some ppl may argue that the current Jiongu is fine as is and doesn't need anything more but I think for the sake of being complete it should have some of it's abilities added into the game that were left out.
Heart Sacrificial System Toggle: This toggle would be something a Jiongu can have enabled or disabled.
If it is enabled: What it would do is, basically during a fight with someone or a raid, if the Jiongu gets killed, He will automatically lose a heart/element and not die. His health and chakra will be brought back up to 50% of their max hp/chakra.
If it is Disabled: If you die while it's disabled, you will simply die and retain all your elements/hearts.
What happens to the elements/hearts that are sacrificed: You will still have your elemental jutsus but you will NOT be able to use them without the heart/element If you try to use them without the heart you would get a personal message in your chatbox saying you do not have the heart/element and cannot use the jutsu.
You would need to go back to hunting for your new heart elements. Also to avoid players using alts to farm hearts, I suggest an IP block that would prevent a jiongu from taking the heart of someone who has the same IP.
Also, Jiongu's should have all the elements as affinities, due to the fact that they're stealing the heart which determines the affinities of elements and not just the element itself.
Shinso Mode (?)
This is the fusion form kakuzu went into after he was reduced to having only 2 demons left, his Fuuton and Katon Demons.
This form would not be accessible without both katon and fuuton demons, it would give a boost to nin and tai, possibly 1.5x nin and tai? Needs debating.
This form would also give access to 1 new jutsu, the Combination Jutsu of Katon: Zukkoku and Fuuton: Atsuugai. This jutsu could possibly be a 3 tiled Or 5 tiled wide beam, it could be a blue/white beam with fire spirals around it. (Similar to the bijuu blast icon) It would do maybe 1.5x nin or 2x nin. And would have a % cost for chakra drain, limiting how many uses a jiongu would have from max chakra, Maybe 5 or 10 uses?
Anyway that's my suggestion for Jiongu, criticism and opinions welcomed.
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Post by Quattro on Nov 4, 2012 19:01:41 GMT -6
I was going to ask what will happen when all the hearts are gone would you still be able to use the elemental jutsu's but I see my question has already been answered lolol Nice job in short time Finz lolol
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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 4, 2012 19:05:10 GMT -6
Yeah I tried to make sure all questions would be answered but there may have been some things I missed. So as I said, any questions/suggestions or complaints that come to mind, feel free to share.
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Post by Apex Barry on Nov 4, 2012 19:33:27 GMT -6
Only thing I disagree with is the affinity idea. The hearts being normal elements should stay as is, think it takes too much from players who have these elements (making them even less unique than they already are) and can potentially overhaul an already somewhat OP clan (in comparison to others).
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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 4, 2012 19:50:47 GMT -6
Well it's all up for debate, I personally don't mind the affinity thing that much, it depends on whether matt is fine with it or not. I'm more about the heart sacrificial system and the shinso mode.
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Post by Iruna Nakara on Nov 5, 2012 6:20:27 GMT -6
its un cool that we have to go hunting again okay like the idea minus the losing of hearts
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Post by Matt on Nov 5, 2012 10:09:12 GMT -6
This idea has been floating around for a while, the problem I have with it is, the health after you die/lose a heart... So if I'm at 100% and say I get hit with a Raikiri, that eats all of my health, I would lose a Heart then my health would be at 50%. That is fine, however by this system, lets say I'm at 10% of my Max, and I am hit with a Raikiri doing the same damage, I lose a heart, yes, but I basiclly gained health because my health goes back up to 50% (Minus a heart you are right, but in the short term its a gain). As for when you "die"/lose a heart I would say make it random...I could attempt to make the damage code do a check to see if you were hit by a Raiton attack, to kill of the Doton Heart if you had it still, if not, it takes a random one, the problem with that is your Suiton heart can't really be "killed" by that same process because it isn't a heart as it is much of an element... I do like the idea of this system, I don't think you should be able to turn off the system though. I think that this would just be a system that they have to live with. If you go fighting attempt not to die or else you have to refill a heart. Another thing I know people are gonna hate, but if you summon a heart out of your body and it dies, you lose it. I can buff them (lets just call them Elementals from now on?). And give them a fun AI system to make them smarter (Moving around Projectiles, Firing Jutsus on their own, etc) As for the Fusion, I think this mode should be able to be entered no matter the heart count. Maybe only limit it to Two Hearts are involved, but saying only Katon and Fuuton seems kinda restrictive. What happens if your Katon heart dies first? the Mode is useless.
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Post by Kurei Hiitaka on Nov 5, 2012 10:30:19 GMT -6
Seems fun xD never really played w/ Jinogu b/c they seemed reliant on their grabby-arm and that giant lava field thing.
Would be fun to see non-canon fusion techs for the ones he didn't fuse, like a sui+do or ka+rai fusion.
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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 5, 2012 10:54:22 GMT -6
I don't have a problem with that way of doing things Matt, sounds fine to me but I think that if the Demons become AI they shouldn't have the exact same stats as the jiongu, but less. It'd be kinda OP'd if I were a capped tai whore for example and just went to a village and summoned all 4 of my demons and let them loose. But then again, not being able to summon them back after they have been destroyed seems like a fair exchange for it. All in all I'm mainly just interested in Jiongu clan being "Complete" as in having the abilities it's currently missing.
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Post by Apex Barry on Nov 5, 2012 12:50:29 GMT -6
Matt, Ramping up the elemental AI? Cool. Buffing them? LOLNOWTF???
Let me explain, as it stands, they can take a hell of a lot of damage, and they can dish it out too. Buffing their damage is barely acceptable, but if you buff their HP too then what the hell ._. At least with them under player control we don't have to worry as much, but with AI + their players attacking us, AND their buffed damage and HP, then it is way too broken and overpowered.
As it stands Jiongu is undoubtedly top tier, you're making them god-like Matt ._. if you make them AI Matt, don't buff them, nerf them down some. Stronger than other AIs, but proportionately weaker than their masters. If they lose a heart it's not that hard to gain a new one (even if you can't take your alt's hearts).
Other than you potentially buffing the Elementals, I have no qualms about giving Jiongu a revamp. Other clans need a revamp too Matt! D:< start with them first, Jiongu's straight for now.
TL;DR: Don't buff the elementals, add a fun AI as you mentioned, but make them weaker than the strong as hell demons we have now.
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Post by Kurei Hiitaka on Nov 5, 2012 13:05:10 GMT -6
I agree w/ the weaker jiongu elementals xD bastards kept sending them 1 by 1 into cloud to torture people w/ massive AoE's....don't let them do that as AI's. Lemme introduce you to RIFT's raid mechanic for AoE AI's: Oh, I have one? I'm an AI not a player? SPAAAAAAAM!!!! If the hearts are AI, they need to be weaker, please. Besides, Akimichi needs some love first.
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Kazuki
ROOT
An Eye for an Eye.. A Tooth for a Tooth... and Evil for Evil. Burn to Ashes
Posts: 600
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Post by Kazuki on Nov 5, 2012 17:09:21 GMT -6
I think the Heart Sacrificial System Toggle should have a req level. No reason why a level 500 joingu should able to use the Sacrificial system. Also Shinso Mode should be more like a passive. Other than that good idea, i would have never thought of this .__.
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♛Stigmata Gillz©
Sound Organization
Believe in the gift of the goddess.
Posts: 1,511
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Post by ♛Stigmata Gillz© on Nov 5, 2012 17:39:03 GMT -6
I agree with matts suggestion
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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 6, 2012 13:08:12 GMT -6
I think the Heart Sacrificial System Toggle should have a req level. No reason why a level 500 joingu should able to use the Sacrificial system. Also Shinso Mode should be more like a passive. Other than that good idea, i would have never thought of this .__. Do you mean like, a jiongu would start out with it being disabled and as he gets higher lvl'd like say, 3k? He'll gain access to the "ability" to sacrifice a heart to stay alive which would take the shape of a toggle? Also Matt the reason I suggested a toggle was cause I can see it inconveniencing players when sparring. It would suck to not be able to have a friendly spar with someone without losing a precious heart. Maybe perhaps, as Kazuki suggested, how about making it a certain lvl req to turn it on/off? Also for the AI Elementals, I think that they should be summoned with Half of your stats. Seeing as you'll be able to summon 4 I don't think a buff is necessary stat-wise. Only thing I disagree with is the affinity idea. The hearts being normal elements should stay as is, think it takes too much from players who have these elements (making them even less unique than they already are) and can potentially overhaul an already somewhat OP clan (in comparison to others). I don't really see that much of an issue with it tbh, logically speaking, Kakuzu didn't just simply gain the elements. He gained the element affinities that the hearts had. It was stated that the extra hearts granted him vast amounts of chakra and numerous elemental affinities. So I don't see why the affinities shouldn't be added in as well.
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Post by Apex Barry on Nov 6, 2012 13:59:15 GMT -6
All the affinity elemental jutsu? Including Mekkakyu? Yeah, I don't want Jiongu getting these in addition to the horde of jutsu they already obtain, and hardly ever use. Giving them access to affinity jutsu is just adding more fuel to an already raging flame.
I already know Kakuzu could do in the manga, but logically speaking, it wouldn't be good for the game. Making an already unbalanced game even more unbalanced isn't exactly a good thing.
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Kazuki
ROOT
An Eye for an Eye.. A Tooth for a Tooth... and Evil for Evil. Burn to Ashes
Posts: 600
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Post by Kazuki on Nov 6, 2012 18:18:59 GMT -6
I think the Heart Sacrificial System Toggle should have a req level. No reason why a level 500 joingu should able to use the Sacrificial system. Also Shinso Mode should be more like a passive. Other than that good idea, i would have never thought of this .__. Do you mean like, a jiongu would start out with it being disabled and as he gets higher lvl'd like say, 3k? He'll gain access to the "ability" to sacrifice a heart to stay alive which would take the shape of a toggle? Yup,exactly what im saying
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Post by Quattro on Nov 7, 2012 15:54:50 GMT -6
Finz I started to icon the Shinso Mode for you
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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 7, 2012 19:20:14 GMT -6
Post that icon when you're done with it I wanna see it
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Post by Quattro on Nov 7, 2012 19:30:47 GMT -6
Post that icon when you're done with it I wanna see it ok
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Post by F.G.D Slayer, Mello on Nov 8, 2012 21:32:50 GMT -6
Gillz has pointed out to me that it would make things somewhat unfair and complicated in tourneys if there was no toggle for the Heart System. Seeing as how it would give a Jiongu an unfair advantage in tourneys, with them needing to die 5 times before they actually "die". With a toggle, they'd be able to turn them off if a rule was made against them sacrificing hearts to stay alive.
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